So, I'm thinking that having some REALY basic attack plans would be a good first step
toward Zen and the art of BC:2. So:

COMMAND CALL PLAYS FOR RUSH OFFENSE

"C4 Demo"
2 Assault loaded for demo and 2 Medics. Everyone pushes together, medics behind assaults, and bombs the target itself or the surrounding structure. SNEAKY-SNEAKY-LIKE.
An M-Com takes 14 C4 normally. Set your Assault specs to Improved Demolitions and Explosives Leg Pouch. Each assault can then carry 5 C4, which is convenient because with Improved Demolitions, it takes exactly 10 C4 to drop an M-COM. Almost like there's a designer out there watching over us. It takes roughly 4 seconds for the two assault to throw the C4. Blow it as soon as it's down unless you're low on ATT and eat the suicide because if you die, your C4 goes away when your warp buffer ends. Cheap? yes. Effective? oh my.
This attack will work best on opponents we can catch unawares. If they're huddling it's better to bring bigger guns.

"Ranged Demo"
1 engineer with rockets, 1 assault with grenades, 1 medic with armor and 1 recon with SVV/SVU and mortar. Set up away from the objective building and stick together, drop ammo and health, then nuke the structure. Remember that the most effective aspect of the mortar is that it shakes the s@# out of the enemy team for a wide radius, making it just this side of impossible to aim. We'd use this generally because the enemy knows we're coming and is taking tickets. We'll use it on the same lvls as C4 demo.

"Smoke Screens"
Here we'll have 2 assaults with smoke and leg satchels (to hold more smoke) and 2 medics one CQB, one LMG. The assaults keep smoke ahead of our advance which should happen at a dead run. The goal is to take out enemy long and mid range with the smoke, confuse the enemy and then drop them with shotguns when they try to diffuse. We'll use this attack on open levels when the enemy thinks they're going to snipe our tickets away. The real beauty of this attack is that it straight ignores half the enemy team, which means they don't get killed, which means they don't get to change classes in response to what we're doing which means we'll be sitting in a dense smoke cloud armed with shotguns and assault rifles waiting to shoot dudes with pistols--- hehehe. This'll be most effective on wide open levels like Isla Innocentes, Arica Harbor and even Valparaiso.
This attack strategy has turned out to be our most popular because it is just so damn effective. oorah.

"Zombie"
Here we have 4 medics, or 3 medics and an engineer (for emplacement killing). A zombie squad stays TOGETHER like more than the others and defibs defibs defibs. We'll do this if we're getting killed in the midground and smoke isn't working. The last push on Port Valdez is a good example of when this can be a good choice. Generally, once we're at the objective, zombie squad can do a good job of holding a lit charge. Even then, STAY TOGETHER, don't spread out to cover all the angles just calmly LOOK at all the angles. If a grenade comes in, calmly walk away from it, one will live to resurrect you. The last medic needs to STAY ALIVE as a warp point for the rest of the squad which should usually switch up to a different format once we're at the objective. We should always watch our tickets and be ready to switch to this setup on the fly. We should NOT be in Zombie when the enemy has good armor on the ground.

"Armor"
This squad gets engineers and jumps into the vehicles. load with armor and rapid reload.

"Artillery Battery"
3 assault with 40mm Grenade launchers and a medic fortifying a position and raining down an endless supply of grenades upon enemy positions. If a charge is planted and it's possible, fire will be focused on to this area to make sure no diffusal. The target will be designated with the squad name. This play brought to you by:FatKungFoo

"Anti Air"
4 Engineers.
Everybody swiches to tracer darts and rockets and focuses on bringing down the hind/havoc. Simple and desperate. The best way to kill attack choppers is when they're on the ground or taking off, something we should never forget and bring to priority one when facing them.


"Mortar Team"
3 bushwookies (read more threads for translation) loaded with mortar, at least 1 VSS and 1 Medic. Set up back from the target and bring rain. For use on demoable M-com buildings.
This play brought to you by :
Reliox

"Free Fire"
Everyone does whatever they think most clever and devious. Done when nothing else is working or when a chaotic attack is in best order.

So, the way these would work in game Example:

We're on Arica Harbor attacking. Enemy has zone 3 on lock down. We're running out of tickets. One of the objectives is damaged, but getting to it seems impossible. Will or I yell, "alright, everyone switch to RANGED DEMO! Spiral squad green double decker trailer, Warmer squad, Construction building!" Everyone switches up appropriately (as they die), moves to position and within a few seconds it's raining rockets. (since this is a fantasy) we go on to win the round handily.

Another Example: Valpraiso attack, first wave, first zone, as we're loading, Will or I say: " Warmer squad, Armor on B, Spiral Squad Smoke Screen on B, Blazing Squad C4 on Alpha." If all 12 ppl knew what that meant that zone would drop QUICK.

Any setups you have in mind please post. We'll read them and probably use them. Make sure to include a name for us to use.

Don't know the effect of this, but how about "Artillery Battery"

4 assault with 40mm Grenade launchers fortifying a position and raining down and endless supply of grenades upon enemy positions. If a charge is planted and it's possible, fire will be focused on to this area to make sure no diffusal.

Fatkungfuu wrote:

Don't know the effect of this, but how about "Artillery Battery"

4 assault with 40mm Grenade launchers fortifying a position and raining down and endless supply of grenades upon enemy positions. If a charge is planted and it's possible, fire will be focused on to this area to make sure no diffusal.

Awesome. That'll be used in game. Should have one medic though. Great idea! With practice (like once they can actually hit the target from a good distance), that could be devistating. Well done sir, well done.

Okay, been doing some research. Seems that folks on the EA forums agree...

AS ZONE 3 IS FALLING 4 engineers rush the hill and tracer/rocket it before/as it takes off. Without doing this we lose if they have a pro pilot.

Some food for discussion/thought. Mostly about the recon class and some possible uses.

What about in the smokescreen group adding a CQB sniper with motion sensors. I leveled up most of my recon class with this makeup. I found it most effective when I was near an assault who could constantly reload my sensors. Two assault running in with smoke, a medic, and motion sensors could be effective.

Also I had a "sniper experience" the other day that proved to me one of the useful roles a sniper can have. Playing Isla, first zone, I found a nice little spot with a good bead on Bravo. I ignored the rest of the island and the desire to rack up free points by just shooting at whatever and kept my head down and myself hidden. I just kept my eye on Bravo. I was able to take out two enemies who tried to disarm. Now I got kind of lucky and had two headshots but if there were say two snipers whose job was "objective protection" paired with two others whose job it was to arm the objective, you'd get a free objective for only two tickets. The reasoning for having two snipers is that two body shots will assuredly kill anyone disarming. Also, once defenders start resonding to the charge, the snipers can drop mortars in not both at once, but in succession.

This idea doesn't work nearlly as well when you are defending since it takes much less time to arm than to disarm. I have tried as a defender to find a hiding spot, and try to shoot attackers as they arm. Normally the time it takes me to reload (I have only used the bolt actions) is about the same amount of time it takes to arm. So if I don't have a head shot on the first shot then the objective is armed by the time I am zoomed back in.

And finally, but not regarding the recon class. I think it would be helpful of we developed some kind of language direction. Meaning, if I say a squad is moving up the right side, do I mean right side of where we spawn or the right side if you were attacking. Most of us already us the spawn as kind of the fixed direction, but it would be helpful to all be on the same page.


Hmm, this turned into a much longer post than I had planned.

native57 wrote:

Hmm, this turned into a much longer post than I had planned.

This is GREAT stuff. I'm putting a recomend in for you to lead Commanche.
You're absolutely right about the recon/armer attack squad. That could be especialy usefull in zones where smoke is not a good option. I suggest that the other team member be an engineer (most versatile when on their own also, they can demo LOS to the target allowing their snigper brothers devious sniping positions). Come up with a call out for this and I'll add it to the list. Hells yeah. Also good call on the motion sensors/smoke combo. I do have a feeling that a medic will be more usefull in most situations (the idea being that instead of finding uot where they are we make it so it doesn't MATTER where they are - feel me?) But either way it's a great idea and am adding it to the list now.

Good stuff but I notice a lack of recon which obviously native has seen too

May I suggest something?

Get one recon, just one, about a mile away, in some scrub or bush with an overview of both objectives (or if your defending, an overview of the enemy's main entrance point to your zone i.e. roads, jungle clearings etc.) make sure they have a mortar and and a bolt action with a 12x scope and the spotter specialisation. The amount of spot assists and armor I've been able to take out has been insane. This also means that you can continue to be effective even if you run out of ammo.

An alternative is to stick one recon in a demo class, with the VSS and a red dot/ 4x scope, it means that you have a mix of short/medium and long range options for when your changing zones or if you have to use counter-sniper tactics.

1st option could replace one medic in Zombies or one SM in Ranged Demo (as in your post)
2nd option fits easily into Smoke Screens (as in your post) or demo (would have to be with the VSS since its full auto).

'Cos to be honest, if you field an entire team without any recon, you're going to die.
The spotting is a big asset, recon actually have the time to press their back/select button to spot, CQB do not. Plus, the only way you'd be able to engage a long-range sniper on the opposing team would be to fire RPGs at them or get yourself a helo and paradrop on their position. Having just one skilled recon makes this a simple task.

Native and I have Recon Man Rage

Also, watch this vid for the ultimate 4 man squad:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=3WClZ1MP4Ck&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fbadcompany2.ea.com%2Fsites%2Fall%2Fmodules%2Frome%2Fpod%2Fmodules%2Fpod_video%2Fvideo_players%2Fvideo_player.swf

Hmm, the reason for the ownage was apparent.

The engineer was using the neostad.

As proof, watch this video.

http://battlefieldbadass.com/videos/view/why-neostead-2000-badass/

Seen it, want it but I still love my .45, its a beauty!

Wolfhide wrote:

'Cos to be honest, if you field an entire team without any recon, you're going to die.

You have some good stuff there. I DO have a lack of recon in those offensive plays.
They are offense on rush specificaly, not conquest.
The reasons:
1. snipers sniping don't arm charges.
2. snipers sniping are too far out to be worth reviving.
3. snipers cannot clear buildings as effectively as others.
4. killing defenders doesn't win matches.
5. mortars aren't as good at bringing down buildings as rockets, c4 or 40mm grenades. They are also slow to fire. They can be good, especialy at counter sniping, they also shake up the enemy which can be great if you're engaging them at range and they are good for roofless lit charge defense, but are usually less effective than their counterparts (rockets/40mm/mines/hand grenades).
6. Not counter sniping is USUALLY fine, since USUALLY we want the defenders to have as many snipers as they are willing to have, because that will be that many fewer ppl we have to kill when we light the charge. This is tried and proven. When there are a lot of snipers defending, they barely slow us down and we have generally won at a dead run, leaving defenders in our old spawn.
7. snipers aren't AS good at defending lit charges (compare to an assault sitting next to it in a cloud of smoke or an engineer with a rocket and grenade or a medic zombifying the other two) UNLESS, as native suggested, that is their sole responsibility or they're set up to do specificaly that.
8. snipers have to get LOS to do anything and can only do it from range, which is usually from the enemy's front, which strikes me as a waste of tickets.
9. For some silly reason none of the effective ranged sniper rifles have silencers, which means enemies know your position, either with the red arrow that appears on their radar or by seeing you fire.
10. Everyone can and should ALWAYS spot. We need to ALL spot all the time, even if it means finger yoga. Anyone confused about the spoting system, please go visit EA's forums.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zcZ3wXF3r14

I'm trying to be objective, learn how the game works and win.... throw in ppl if you want to see plays with snipers, even if for no better reason than you just like them, we can figure stuff out.

Suggest plays with snipers too please.

I should add that recon is awesome in conquest mode and if/when Apaches and Seminoles get more into that, we'll field LOTS of Recon.

NEW PLAY. In response to the overwhelming attack choppers...

"Anti Air"
4 Engineers.
Everybody swiches to tracer darts and rockets and focuses on bringing down the hind/havoc. Simple but desperate. The best way to kill attack choppers is when they're on the ground or taking off, somthing we should never forget and bring to priority one when facing them.

Throwing it out there in regards to recon. So far the most effective counter sniper I have run into was the UAV.

One person on the UAV with members calling in where they were shot from and you get a very effective killing machine.

native57 wrote:

Throwing it out there in regards to recon. So far the most effective counter sniper I have run into was the UAV.

One person on the UAV with members calling in where they were shot from and you get a very effective killing machine.

word. shielded MGs too (on normal mode defense) own all snipers. You just spot spam and whack em. They'll usually mortar you eventually but not till after you've taken 3-10 tickets, or if you're the attacker, lost 3-10 tickets.

ehh nah wahhh?

Spiralus wrote:

NEW PLAY. In response to the overwhelming attack choppers...

"Anti Air"
4 Engineers.
Everybody swiches to tracer darts and rockets and focuses on bringing down the hind/havoc. Simple but desperate. The best way to kill attack choppers is when they're on the ground or taking off, somthing we should never forget and bring to priority one when facing them.

I think you are overestimating the choppers... yeah if you get a seasoned guy into the gunner seat they're deadly, but I think most of us can't keep a *high recoil gun* (*debatable) on a target while going 40 mph... also the rockets on the attack helicopters are difficult to kill things with, especially infantry. I would only have 2 engineers working on them, for they aren't that deadly... They are important to take down, but not enough that we have to use an entire squad to take them down, and what happens after the chopper is down? Then we have 4 engineers with kits for taking down helicopters. I think we should keep the idea, but tone down the volume. Feel free to comment or change ideas.

[quote="blazingsun"]

Spiralus wrote:

NEW PLAY. In response to the overwhelming attack choppers...

I think you are overestimating the choppers... yeah if you get a seasoned guy into the gunner seat they're deadly, but I think most of us can't keep a *high recoil gun* (*debatable) on a target while going 40 mph... also the rockets on the attack helicopters are difficult to kill things with, especially infantry. I would only have 2 engineers working on them, for they aren't that deadly... They are important to take down, but not enough that we have to use an entire squad to take them down, and what happens after the chopper is down? Then we have 4 engineers with kits for taking down helicopters. I think we should keep the idea, but tone down the volume. Feel free to comment or change ideas.

Right on. This is a desperate play here only because of an acknowledged mechanical imbalance in the game. The attack choppers have been nerfed by the developer DICE ( to be less maneuverable ) on PC already (refer to EA forums) and xbox is assumedly pending. There aren't many of them out there, but a pro team in a Hind is nearly invincible once airborn. Pilot loads chaffe, gunner loads armor, 2 engineers repairing in back. It needs to be hit with 2 rockets almost simultaneously to die. Also, good gunner and pilot combos absolutely can and will kill you and from very high up.
Ask anyone who was with me for this game:
We faced a pro chopper team the other night, we had flawlessly disected Isle Innocentes, (losing ~ 10 ATT total) up to the last zone then got spawn killed by the one chopper, literaly warping in and dieing repeatedly while helplessly trying to hit it with rockets and tracers. It was too high and moving too fast though and we lost the match (and it wasn't even close, we were owned)
I

snipers are not a necessity, but they can be a important factor in battle. It is important with snipers to not over or underestimate them... and I think both Spiralus and wolfhide were doing that. It's not a good idea to have too many snipers, but not a good idea to have none at all. I would recommend maybe two snipers max, for snipers aren't the most important class, but they do play an important role. I would have less of the normal sniping, arming charges, and killing kind of thing that most blues do, and have more of a supervisor role, and when trouble arises, a sniper can take action, but will try to help the squad and team more than themselves. Their is no point in arguing why a class is good or not in specific detail, instead, come up with a compromise that will make the class more of a gift then a burden on a squad/team.

same thing with the anti air squad as with the last post I made, lets just make sure that it's clear to everyone that it's an option, but not one recommended until needed... I agree with you, but lets make it clear to anyone not looking on this forum that this is NOT the kind of class we start a battle with.

blazingsun wrote:

come up with a compromise that will make the class more of a gift then a burden on a squad/team.

Word. Let's get some plays with snipers. Like Native's. Sorry if I was being too one sided . I guesse really I'm just sick of smerfs sitting in my warp while I'm arming charges.

I do still have reservations, but AM listening.

blazingsun wrote:

lets make it clear to anyone not looking on this forum that this is NOT the kind of class we start a battle with.

absolutely

-As noted by Native (deecon) while using the zombie play we need to be careful with vehicles and remember to let somone die so he can respawn as a demo and we can kill it.

-I think bravo in zone 1 on Port Valdez has been nerfed so the structure is harder to bring down. If true this is note worthy for offense and D.

-We need to work on spotting. Whenever you look at where you think they may be SPAM spot (this means push select a bunch, even if you don't see anyone) Spotting has a cumulative cooldown though, so don't push it real fast, just real often. This will pick up everything from far distant snipers to tanks hidden in dust and anything else we may not have otherwise known about. Right now I feel that I am highlighting roughly 1/2 the guys we get spotted. It should feel like we're having a contest to see who can spot people first. It should feel warm and fuzzy when you're the first to spot somone. More spotting!

-We need to pay more attention to our tickets and be more vocal about it when they're depleting. We had a couple close calls tonight mostly because we weren't doing a good enough job of this (I'm included). As soon as we realized we were low, we tightened up and got the job done, but it was too close. So, if you notice our ATT dropping fast, say so right away and say it loud.

-This also goes for whenever you feel like an attack plan isn't working, even if it was an order just recently given. Somone stepped up tonight (don't know who, please claim responsibility, I owe you) and announced an attack I called was failing. They were right. We just barely had time to switch up and won the zone. When you get an attack order you should be thinking "MWAHAHAHAHAHA", not "OH CRAP, this isn't working." That you should be saying.

-Same goes for where you are. If you catch your squad warping into a ticket giveaway party say so loudly and directly. "Stop warping there!"

So today I tried out Wolfhide's idea and was pleasantly surprised.

The VSS I didn't know is a fully automatic sniper rifle. I put on a 4x scope and was able to both attack and snipe reasonably well. Paired with an assault to reload ammo you kind of get an engineer type weapon with C4 and motion sensors.

native57 wrote:

So today I tried out Wolfhide's idea and was pleasantly surprised.

The VSS I didn't know is a fully automatic sniper rifle. I put on a 4x scope and was able to both attack and snipe reasonably well. Paired with an assault to reload ammo you kind of get an engineer type weapon with C4 and motion sensors.

MWAHAHAHAHAHA its like a marksman engineer, who looks like a walking bush (you don't see an RPG tube running at you from a mile away)

I'm not too big of a fan of the VSS. While it does provide you a mix between Assault and Sniper I find it does not really fit the role in either and thus isn't as useful. The M16 with a 4x scope is better within Short-Medium range and from Medium-Long range the VSS really isn't anything great.

The M16 is pretty epic with a sight